Shattered Rift

Werewolf - Mansionwolf 2: Duality

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Please consult the Werewolf Introduction and Gameplay article for basic gameplay etiquette. In addition to the existing guidelines, the following rules will be in effect during this game:
  • Dead players may not request a rez.
  • If players become aware of cheating, they should immediately bring it to the MC's attention. They should not inform other players of the cheating. Players should not bring up cases of past or present cheating publicly or privately, except to the MC.
  • Players are not allowed to insult each other on a personal or group level. Please criticize a player's argument, not the player themself. I will determine whether or not a particular case has crossed the line and whether or not it requires punishment. If you would like to submit a case for review, please either PM me or use the Report button on the side of the relevant post.

Execution will be determined by plurality: the player with the most votes will be executed. Votes must target a living player (nobody votes are not allowed). A player must be executed each Day. If there is a tie, I will use a randomizer to decide who will be executed.

Votes will lock at 9 PM PDT / Midnight EDT (UTC - 7). Results for will follow sometime after, and the exact timing may vary from night to night. As I will be recording Nightly video plots, please allow for an hour after deadline for recording/upload time. Day 1 will go for 48 hours, ending Saturday night. Players may vote to extend a given Day to 48 hours. This vote should be done separately from execution voting. If a majority (51%+) of living players have voted to extend Day by the time deadline occurs, the Day will be extended.

Role names will not be given to innocent players in their role PMs. However, role names will be revealed upon death.
 

The Plain Innocent PM is included here:
 

Win Condition: Eliminate all evil players.

I wonder what mechanic Rift included in this game that affects plain innocents?

 

 
Living Players (6)

1) Nell

2) Steev

3) InuyashaOhki

4) Lieutenant-colonel Franc

5) MrHeatherway

6) Silver

 

Dead Players (14)
1) K23, Gibbous Necromancer (Executed Day 1)

2) Blacjak, Gibbous Dreamer (Executed Day 2) Resurrected Night 3
2) Neopetsmom, Mason (Mauled Night 2)

3) Sinical, Luminous Werewolf (Bound to Neopetsmom, Died Night 2)
4) StratusNova, Half Moon Cupid (Executed Day 3)

5) Kirby-oh, Mason (Mauled Night 3)
6) Kathy, Plain Innocent (Executed Day 4)

7) Red, Crescent Dreamer (Mauled Night 4)

8) Clucky, Plain Innocent (Shot Night 4)

9) Celairiel, Gibbous Werewolf (Executed Day 5)

10) Liz, Crescent Protector (Mauled Night 5)
11) kittenz, Plain Innocent (Executed Day 6)
12) Technocactus, Gibbous Protector (Mauled Night 6)

13) thelilbear, Plain Innocent (Executed Day 7)
14) Blacjak, Gibbous Dreamer (Mauled Night 7)

Edited by Shattered Rift

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How did get first post?! I'm suddenly more excited for this game than before. I don't know why. Probably the videos.

 

Edit: forgot to say that about the videos.

Edited by Celairiel

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Because day 1 votes are always random, I'm gonna give everyone til mid day then randomly vote for someone who hasn't donned a duck avatar  :)

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Because day 1 votes are always random, I'm gonna give everyone til mid day then randomly vote for someone who hasn't donned a duck avatar  :)

I will back this movement wholeheartedly.

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Checking in.

 

And then riiiiight back out because CANDIDACY.

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All ze ducks are wolves wearing a duck costume! :o Such a clever trick... to hide the scariness in such a cute thing

 

PDT is UTC -8 isn't it? regardless of any daylight savings in effect :3

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First.....person from euro-nope, techno ruined that as well.

 

 

 

Okay, so in case people had not read the rules. Vote is done by plurality and a living player must be executed. Be careful with the random votes and watch out for any evidence of the informed minority (aka the evil team).

 

If it comes down to it and we feel it is the best tactic, we could simply all vote for the person below us in the player list order. This would give us a completely random execution, although I personally do not think it's the best approach to take. It would however probably be the easiest one to get people on board with.

 

Another tactic, which I'm still considering the viability of is having every person who is a PI, claim to be one. We then execute a random PI claim. This will give us a few advantages.

A: Most evil players will likely claim to be one. This limits the potential people we have to look at.

B: It'd give us the best odds of execution on an evil player day one.

C: In the case of a bad execution, we only lose a PI.

D: Any evil player that wants to claim a PI has to do so early. This will stop them claiming other roles later.

 

Downsides are that we don't know how the PIs are used this game aaand it paints a target on the power roles that we have.

 

So yeah, thoughts?

Edited by Sinical

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Just wanted to say that I'm here. I won't get the chance to watch the video for a little while though as I'll be out shopping (yay).

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Voting for the person below you sounds risky. All it takes is someone refusing to play along to wreck it.

And voting for those without duck avatars seems like a nice way to start a bandwagon without any meaningful discussion, risk of executing anyone evil or chance for recriminations when an innocent dies.

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I couldn't help but read "Private Investigator" every time you said PI. :P

This is only my second game here, so I don't know what is typical of this group. I would be wary of a third party in a group this size with plain innocent roles.

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If somebody refuses to go along with the vote person below, you can easily make adjustments to give everybody one vote.

 

The only risk is somebody deliberately sabotaging it, but then you have a guaranteed target for the execution the following day. No evil player would be that stupid. 

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So, plurality voting, and no votes for bypassing execution.  That means that even today, we should be looking for information.  Sinical, your plan, while allowing us a random execution, does nothing to gain us information.  It's quite literally a delaying plan at best.  We take someone out (and be honest, it would have a better chance of hitting an innocent than a baddie), and then let the baddies take out another one of us.  Suddenly, we're two people down, and really have no more information than we would have otherwise.

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So, plurality voting, and no votes for bypassing execution.  That means that even today, we should be looking for information.  Sinical, your plan, while allowing us a random execution, does nothing to gain us information.  It's quite literally a delaying plan at best.  We take someone out (and be honest, it would have a better chance of hitting an innocent than a baddie), and then let the baddies take out another one of us.  Suddenly, we're two people down, and really have no more information than we would have otherwise.

 

This is why I said that it's not my recommended plan, but is just the one that people with most easiest go with.

 

The actual thing I'd like people to do is a mass PI claim, but I know there's no way in hell I'd get everyone to agree to that. It is so much easier getting crazy plans working when you're evil. sigh

 

As for "we're more likely to hit an innocent than an evil player".

Of course that's the case.

But the payoff for hitting an evil player is several times higher than that of hitting an innocent.

 

I would argue though, that the odds of hitting an evil player in a plurality game is pretty damn low regardless. A truly random execution honestly gives you better odds, you just lose the "information" that you may or may not get. If this was a live game where points can be thrown back and forth with most people chiming in, then there would be valuable info.

But the thing I've learned about WW games on here in the first day or two is that most people will have a post or two, a vote where they declare they are unsure, or a purely random vote as there is no information and then go off without looking at the thread until the next day. There is little conversation, and without conversation there is very rarely useful information.

 

 

What of the chance of accidental sabotage? You could probably make it work, but I don't see a reason to.

 

What do you mean by accidental sabotage? It's quite a simple thing for people to follow, unless a person does not read the thread in the slightest before voting.

 

 

Quick question for Rift: Are all players required to vote for someone for execution?

 

He said that a player must be executed each day. If your plan was that nobody votes, I would assume that counts as everyone tying as zero votes. Which would admittedly be an easier way of organising things.

Edited by Sinical

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I'll go out on a limb and say: I am a plain innocent with the power to vote for one person daily for execution. That being said, things are definitely likely to change in this game, so please don't kill me!

 

@Sinical - The reason I asked the question is because Rift's opening post didn't explicitly say that each person had to vote every day, which is something I had seen in other games. If each person does not have to vote, it's also a really easy way to fly under the radar and influence execution by the lack of voting. Just something I'm curious about as I would want to watch votes carefully.

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I couldn't help but read "Private Investigator" every time you said PI. :P

This is only my second game here, so I don't know what is typical of this group. I would be wary of a third party in a group this size with plain innocent roles.

 

Just wanna understand what 'third party in a group this size' means :3

 

As for having a mass claim of PI role, I'm not too keen as the non-innocent PIs are also narrowed down which makes it easier for baddies to target, as you mentioned in the downsides.

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I agree with the concern regarding exposing power roles so early. Especially since Rift likes PI roles. I wouldn't be surprised if we have a lot of them. It could narrow down our power players quite nicely for the wolves. Additionally, he'll have given them some hidden value; with no idea how much that's going to influence the game, I wouldn't yet consider a PI death to be less harmful to us. While, yes, it probably would be, I don't think that's a call we should be making Day 1. 

 

Another concern I have with a mass role-claim is actually a lesson learned from Sinical. Despite being quite amused and pleased with the results of his network last game, as an innocent, I look at that and get nervous regarding how dangerous a chain can be. On one hand, it can allow the innocents to unite and sweep the victory (which, depending on how quickly it happens feels either triumphant or a bit boring, I would think). On the other, a compromised network can lose us the game. I understand that having PIs claim on thread would be different, but I can see it easily resulting in everyone else teaming up behind the scenes. Including any wolves gutsy enough to make up a role. 

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Although not related to this game, and while it does not invalidate your point..I didn't really set up a role claim chain last game. I mostly worked with a few people at the time, most importantly making sure protectors contacted me.

 

But as I had said before, I knew there would be huge opposition to the idea of PIs claiming. Meh.

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Yeah not sure how claiming PIs will help as at all. Helps the wolves far more. 

 

If we want to do an actually random execution, lets pick three people (say Sinical, Cel and Kittenz because they are above me) and have them each send me a random english word. I'll concatenate them (in the order Sinical, Cel, Kittenz) and use the MD5 hash to index into the player list. Unless all three people generating the hash key are in on it, result will be essentially random. (I'd share the three words so that everyone can validate the results)

 

or I can just vote for someone who doesn't have a duck  :)

Edited by Clucky

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I couldn't help but read "Private Investigator" every time you said PI. :P

This is only my second game here, so I don't know what is typical of this group. I would be wary of a third party in a group this size with plain innocent roles.

Just wanna understand what 'third party in a group this size' means :3

As for having a mass claim of PI role, I'm not too keen as the non-innocent PIs are also narrowed down which makes it easier for baddies to target, as you mentioned in the downsides.

An evil team with more than 3 players is too powerful, and the game is large enough to need 4+ villains. The easiest way to handle that as an MC is a third party- either a powerful OMT or a team that has to kill both innocent and wolf teams. There are plenty of other options, and I don't know Rifts MC style, but given the quick pass off, my assumption is a third team. Some sort of evil human, like mafiosos or a secret society.

And, yes, the mass PI reveal is a bad idea. I am a little worried about being too critical until I am used to the new rules, otherwise I would say something else. I'm applying the Thumper rule: If you can't say something nice, don't say nothing at all.

Edited by InuyashaOhki

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