Blacjak

Gunslingers

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Plot:

 

On a cold and dreary night much like this one, caravans and cowboys would each sit around the campfire. They would pass the time spinning tall tales and weaving wonders that put the warmth back in your bones, or left you shivering in your boots. There is a story that is often told on such a night. Some believe it to be true, others a myth, but most know it well. Lend me your ear tonight, if you dare, and I will impart to you these fabled words of the west.

The Ghostyard Gallows. It's a haunting name for sure, and fitting of the tragedy that befell it's victims. Wanderers often speak of passing through such a place. Some say it's a mound of earth littered with carrion crawlers writhing about in the moonlight, others a mining town reduced to ash and dust. Believe what you like, but it didn't used to always be this way. You see, not far from here the Raven Rock Riders gang used to control much of the territory. They were a civilized bunch and worked together much like an ordinary community. After years of ravaging the countryside, they settled down in a small town lost to history and largely reformed their ways. Even appointed a their own Sheriff to take care of things!

Now things went well like this for a bit, but see, some of the men got restless and took to exploring Raven Rock on their own. Now you might think that they were never heard from again, but I promise you that would have been a blessing. These ruffians found something alright, and they brought it back to the tavern to celebrate their luck. What did they find you ask? Why a whole trunk full of gold. Each item was painstakingly crafted with the most detailed of designs. They didn't know it then, but each piece was equally as deadly as they were beautiful.

In the morning they awoke to the Timekeeper calling for High Noon. Unsurprisingly they had slept the day away, or so it had seemed. For as the hours passed, the day grew hotter. And just like the broken clock in the square, the sun did not move. The gold, now shimmering in the heat, was more dazzling than ever. The Sheriff heard wind of this and confronted the town. No one really knew who was responsible, the gold had already been passed around to every drunken fool in that tavern, hell, the whole town. It wasn't said outright, but they all knew a terrible curse had befallen them. It was then decided that the spoils should be gathered up and taken back where they came from. However, when the posse tried to leave, they found themselves riding back into town from the other side. They were trapped.

Voices were raised and blood boiled higher in the heat than ever, but the Sheriff tried to keep the peace. He suggested that they speak with the Shaman, he was bound to know what to do about the curse. When the Sheriff found the man in question, he was deep in mediation. Ordinarily, the townsfolk didn't have much respect for the Shaman, but considering the circumstances, the Sheriff tried to be polite and wait. With a gasp, the eyes of the Shaman flew open in terror.

"What have you done?!"

The wiry man quickly stood and grabbed his staff, rushing outside into the glaring sun. Naturally, the town had been waiting outside with baited breath and stood nervously, their palms itching and their brows covered in sweat.

"You have defiled the ancestors and have incurred their wrath! None shall survive if they are not appeased through a sacrifice in blood. You must find those responsible for this deed and punish them before we are all doomed to die under their fire!"

In a panic, everyone drew their sidearms and started shouting accusations.

It's High Noon.

Rules:

 

1. Private Communication is not allowed, with the exception of PMs started by myself. This is very important for balance due to the inclusion of a public role.

 

2. High Noon occurs between Midnight and 5am EST. The Timekeeper will announce when the next High Noon is, but the time will vary between High Noons due to the stationary sun making timekeeping difficult. High Noon is equivalent to a standard deadline. Please do not edit posts after deadline as this will interfere with results.

 

3. All Players have 3 HP each, a Gun, and a Bullet. The Sheriff is confirmed innocent, and starts with an additional Vest as well as the Ability to Deputize Players, granting them a Bullet.

 

4. You may Shoot another player by posting BANG! In bold on thread while telling me your target privately. At High Noon, all Players Shot will be revealed in a random order. Players Shot lose 1 HP in the order that they are Shot, so Shooting first does matter. You may Shoot as many times as you have Bullets, but may only BANG! once per post. There may be Abilities with exceptions to this rule.

 

5. You may publicly Challenge another player to a Duel at least 12 hours before results. Challenges less than 12 hours before the upcoming High Noon will count for the next High Noon. That player must publicly Accept before the applicable High Noon is posted or they will be assumed to have Fled. A player who Flees will drop all Items and be prevented from using Abilities during High Noon. During the Duel, both Players will Shoot all their Bullets regardless of HP. If both Players are capable of killing the other, the Duel will be resolved by coin flip. You cannot Challenge a Player who has already issued or been issued a Challenge that cycle.

 

6. There are two forms of currency in this game. Fame and Fortune. Earn 1 Fame for each non-spam post, up to 5 per High Noon. Earn 5 Fortune for each Active Ability use. Abilities may only be used once per High Noon. There may be other methods of earning currency dependent on your role.

 

7. The Shop: To purchase an item, you must PM me before the end of the cycle with what you wish to buy. There may be other methods of acquiring Items dependent on your role.

Spend 3 Fame to use an Active Ability.

Spend 10 Fortune to buy a Bullet.

Spend 15 Fortune buy a Vest which Blocks one Bullet.

 

8. Each cycle you may Give a single Item to another Player. To do so, notify me by PM before the end of the cycle.

 

9. If you die, you are condemned to the Ghostly Gallows and may post on the main thread in colored italics, including ghastly sounds. ooOoooOOoooo! If you were killed outside of a Duel, you gain one Revenge Bullet that you must use that cycle and can only affect the Player who killed you, which is not revealed. To Shoot a Revenge Bullet you must post, PEW! PEW! [Player] I Shoot you! So as such, your target is public unlike typical gunfire.

 

10. Everything will be processed at once, the order is as follows:

  1. Earning Fame
  2. Buying Items
  3. Gifting Items
  4. Duels
  5. Abilities
  6. Shots- In order by Post
  7. Earning Fortune

When you receive your results, first I will post the outcome of any Duels, then in a random order, the Players who lost HP, and announce the dead. Each Player will then be sent a PM containing their total Fame, Fortune, HP, Items, and Ability outcomes.

 

The Timekeeper announced that the next High Noon will be at 5am Eastern on Saturday the 6th.

 

Sinical has been selected as the Sheriff. His goal is the elimination of the Ruffians.

 

Remember that although there is no execution, your opinion really packs a punch.

 

Players:

1. Sheriff Sinical- Shot to death during the 7th High Noon

2. Deputy Deputy weeenuyasha

3. Deputy Lightning Cel- Shot to death during the 6th High Noon

4. Deputy Traj

5. Rex

6. Deputy Rift- Died in a Duel against Zilary during the 7th High Noon

7. Rock- Watchdog- Died in a Duel against Cel during the 4th High Noon

8. Lion

9. Zilary

Edited by Blacjak

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I have a few questions regarding rules. First, there is no other way to get bullets besides 1) purchasing them with Fortune, 2) getting them from being deputized, and 3) any miscellaneous ability which gives bullets (and may or may not exist), correct? Second, what are the limits on the Sheriff's ability to deputize? Does he have to pay Fame to do so? Can he do it more than once per High Noon? Is the bullet granted immediately or at some time during High Noon processing? Are the Sheriff's deputies made public? Third, when you give an item, is that a public transaction? If not, is the recipient made aware of who gave him any particular item?

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1. Correct.

2. Deputy is an Active Ability. Active Abilities cost 3 Fame to use. Active Abilities can only be used once per High Noon. Abilities are processed during the Ability Phase in the processing order. Deputies are in fact made public.

3. Giving Items is not public. The recipient is not made aware of the identity of the donator.

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I still find Sinical suspicious, even as a confirmed innocent.

Do we still wait to kill, or do we just start shooting and hope for the best?

I'm personally leaning towards saving bullets for the moment and seeing what we learn tomorrow, but admittedly I don't know how this will play out. I ran an everybody-shoots game before on Twitter, but it was structured a lot differently. The innocent team lost because they didn't communicate (one had the bigger shot, another knew the villains and didn't share that info), but obviously that's not an option here.

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Isn't the most logical approach to have Sinical instruct even numbered players to shoot player N while odd-numbered players shoot player M? (Or possibly a three-way split.)

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39c.jpg

I never liked 5th Gen.

Also note that the deadline has been changed to midnight tonight. Forgot I work the morning shift today.

Edited by Blacjak

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It should be obvious from my analytical posts with what little we have to go from that I'm trying to earn Fame so that my ability will work. I suggest not trying to lie low as an innocent, since that will just leave you defenseless at the end of the game if you survive.

Since the game asked for volunteers for sheriff/ruffian, I'll earn my Fame this post by analyzing that: 

Traj - I have no doubt he volunteered. He has an occasionally noticeable increased interest in games when he has a major role. Almost certainly volunteered for both.

Rift - He seems to always join games on the contingency of "if you need someone". This time, though, he was exuberant enough to post (the shootey word starting with "B") in signups, so I think he was excited about it.

Rock - Probably volunteered. He was playing at being a gunslinger in the thread. I'm fairly certain he's interested in the theme enough to want a key role. 

Zilary - I honestly have no clue. She sounded interested, but also offered to be an alternate and mentioned time constraints. It's a tossup, but I'll skew her slightly higher than Rex because Blac might have prompted her to volunteer privately with her last minute signup.

Rex - Might not have volunteered, but he probably did.

Lion - He tends to lie low in other games and even gave us some pretty good insight into this in the Enforcing Activity discussion. It's possible he volunteered, but he's not a top suspect. Particularly with the lackluster "I'm in." signup.

Cel - Has had bouts of unavoidable inactivity lately, and Voce isn't with her this game. Her signup was an "I'll try" rather than something more exuberant like Rift. Based on what she's said, I think she's not likely to have volunteered for either.

I'm leaving myself off, because me analyzing me is pointless. Someone else can earn Fame analyzing me. Of course, Sinical got Sheriff, so he definitely volunteered. We also know that not everyone who volunteered got a ruffian/sheriff position.

In order of my suspicion of them volunteering: Traj, Rift, Rock, Zilary, Rex, Lion, and Cel.

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I meant more that with Sinical as a confirmed innocent, we know that any target selection he makes is unbiased by alignment (whether we follow up on it now or later). Meanwhile, since we're not in a vote format, I think it's entirely possible that we have three Ruffians (perhaps with lower health than the rest of us). That might depend on investigative abilities... or it might not. On the other hand, the Ruffians are the only ones pressured to-

Ah, right, there's the flaw in my logic. That is, assuming that one of the Ruffians can't shoot invisibly.

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You're right, Inu, I absolutely would have volunteered for both - had I remembered to volunteer at all. Whoops.

Honestly, I'm going to need to reread the rules a couple more times. I love a complicated game, but this is definitely one of the more complex I've played in a long time.

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3 hours ago, InuyashaOhki said:

Cel - Has had bouts of unavoidable inactivity lately, and Voce isn't with her this game. Her signup was an "I'll try" rather than something more exuberant like Rift. Based on what she's said, I think she's not likely to have volunteered for either.

You hit the nail on the head. I was planning on being out of town today, and working basically every other day the game is running, but then illness happened and here I am at home, frantically running errands. :) And playing!! I'm very excited, despite my lackluster sign up. Blac previously told me that he wanted to run a game where everyone has a gun, and I've been looking forward to it since July! 

In addition to who may have volunteered, I think a good discussion would be how many ruffians we have. With a standard game of nine, I can see 2 ruffians, max of three, with a possible neutral/OMT if there were only 2 ruffians. I can see Blac giving the innocents specific end-goals or adding a neutral/OMT that didn't require volunteering. This would minimize the likelihood of us narrowing down potential ruffians purely on the basis of who would volunteer for something like that.

As for analyzing you, Inu, I think you probably volunteered. You only play in games where you expect to be able to give your all. I don't see you not signing up for every possible option in any game you join. 

As for Traj claiming to forget. While that's totally something we may anticipate in general (see the crux of the inactivity issue), I also think we need to realize that claiming to have not volunteered is essentially a claim of innocence. It should be trusted no more than any other such claim made on thread with no supporting evidence.

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29 minutes ago, Celairiel said:

As for analyzing you, Inu, I think you probably volunteered. You only play in games where you expect to be able to give your all. I don't see you not signing up for every possible option in any game you join. 

As for Traj claiming to forget. While that's totally something we may anticipate in general (see the crux of the inactivity issue), I also think we need to realize that claiming to have not volunteered is essentially a claim of innocence. It should be trusted no more than any other such claim made on thread with no supporting evidence.

Yep on me. Which is why I say not everyone who volunteered got to be a ruffian. I didn't volunteer for sheriff, though, and I don't envy Sinical in that job.

I'd also agree on Traj. His response is neutral. It's what a villain would say, but it's just as likely to be true. He'd be the one I would investigate tonight if I had a dreamer role (totally not what I have, don't shoot me). It's not enough to target him for, though.

@Shattered Rift - I knew what you meant, but it's pretty obvious with your choice of targets (M and N) what your alignment is. I'm definitely not telling you my real name or giving you a picture of my face. :P 

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I don't think analyzing who may or may not have volunteered is a good avenue of analysis. I think the whole volunteering thing was actually a terrible idea (except for Sheriff, since it's a public role). I also suspect that a very small number of people (if any) volunteered. If they didn't do it instantly when they signed up, I don't think they did it at all. Also, since whoever volunteered is private, blacjak could have easily discarded the notion and randomized baddies without saying anything. So I don't think looking at who would be inclined to volunteer is good analysis.

That being said, I think it's interesting that was the tack that Inu decided to take for his first post. There are lots of other avenues to examine (some of which I will be discussing momentarily), especially with a game this unique. So I think it's possible that the entire discussion of volunteering is meant to be a red herring, which would seem to indicate that Inu is a Ruffian. What do the rest of you think?

With regards to set-up, I expect that there are two Ruffians and at least one Neutral/OMT-type role floating around. I think three Ruffians might be a tad overloaded on the baddie side (even with a public innocent that they are disincentivized to kill). Hard to say without a full picture, though.

The first strategy I want to examine is the idea of a possible full claim. It's generally a terrible idea for a public full claim to happen early on in Werewolf, but this game is substantially different. It's pretty important that the Sheriff know who he can deputize safely (don't want the baddies to get extra bullets). Given that it seems that the resources gained by the innocents will outweigh the resources gained by the baddies until the innocents start dying off, making it require only baddie resources to accomplish innocent death seems really good. What do you all think about potentially forcing a public full claim?

Second, I want to discuss how we should use our bullets. Obviously an individual can choose to use their bullets whenever and however they want. However, bullet usage is a big behavioral indicator of alignment. Personally, I definitely think we should hold bullets on day 1 and potentially later as well. As Rift pointed out, it seems likely that the pressure on the baddies to shoot first (since they'll have to kill the rest of us to win). Additionally, if we're not shooting early, the innocent "team" will get bullets and vests faster than the baddie "team", unless they have abilities to offset that (and even then, to use those abilities, they need to post, which gives us chances to catch them). Also, I don't think we should have a public set of people guaranteed to shoot player X simply because that would make it really easy for baddies to land revenge bullets (although I suppose that risk is somewhat minimal considering the low baddie count... but it's another reason to force baddies to kill innocents and minimize innocent "friendly-fire").

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Have no fear, Foxy the Kid is here. 

Inu. I see your missing an eye their pilgrim. Lets not forget lady luck has a had in this game and a dust up isn't on schedule till the final curtain so lets sit back and in joy the show. 

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@Rexozord

I agree with your thoughts that having a public set of people target a player is dangerous. I would think that baddies could interrupt that process somehow. Or they would let it happen if it was an innocent targeted. Either way, it seems like that is too favorable for the baddies. 

On the other hand, since there is no private communication in this game, some sort of public plan has to be made. Otherwise, it would be chaos in the streets. There would be people shooting at their friends and neighbors. Riots. 

There must be law.

 Sheriff, what say you?!

Edited by lion wiggles

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Re: Full Claim: With so few players, it's entirely possible that a few powers have been subverted. That said, I would expect netting at least one (or maybe two but probably not more than three) "confirmed" innocents out of such a strategy, which might be enough to carry the game. (If there's also a dreamer, that might be the deciding factor.) Which is another reason I expect a baddie team of three rather than two. I would also assume that baddies don't win via majority given their probable inability to nightkill. (There might be one with one extra bullet each Noon, or something.) If we announce our targets before shooting, this might be able to minimize revenge shots by innocents against innocents.

My final opinion on the strategy is still undecided, but if a majority of non-Sinical players agree to a full claim, I would join it.

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I was hoping that I would get more than one response regarding public claiming before end of Day 1. That being said, provided that no one shoots anyone else in the next hour or so, it probably doesn't matter too much whether we discuss it on Day 1 or Day 2. I do find it interesting that most players have not made the requisite number of posts in order to be able to use an active ability tonight. I was hoping that if we could avoid shooting today, this High Noon would give us a solid idea of what might happen on a daily basis, but with post counts so low, it's unlikely that anything at all will happen this High Noon (as far as I can tell).

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5 hours ago, Rexozord said:

I don't think analyzing who may or may not have volunteered is a good avenue of analysis. I think the whole volunteering thing was actually a terrible idea (except for Sheriff, since it's a public role). I also suspect that a very small number of people (if any) volunteered. If they didn't do it instantly when they signed up, I don't think they did it at all. Also, since whoever volunteered is private, blacjak could have easily discarded the notion and randomized baddies without saying anything. So I don't think looking at who would be inclined to volunteer is good analysis.

That being said, I think it's interesting that was the tack that Inu decided to take for his first post. There are lots of other avenues to examine (some of which I will be discussing momentarily), especially with a game this unique. So I think it's possible that the entire discussion of volunteering is meant to be a red herring, which would seem to indicate that Inu is a Ruffian. What do the rest of you think?

With regards to set-up, I expect that there are two Ruffians and at least one Neutral/OMT-type role floating around. I think three Ruffians might be a tad overloaded on the baddie side (even with a public innocent that they are disincentivized to kill). Hard to say without a full picture, though.

The first strategy I want to examine is the idea of a possible full claim. It's generally a terrible idea for a public full claim to happen early on in Werewolf, but this game is substantially different. It's pretty important that the Sheriff know who he can deputize safely (don't want the baddies to get extra bullets). Given that it seems that the resources gained by the innocents will outweigh the resources gained by the baddies until the innocents start dying off, making it require only baddie resources to accomplish innocent death seems really good. What do you all think about potentially forcing a public full claim?

Second, I want to discuss how we should use our bullets. Obviously an individual can choose to use their bullets whenever and however they want. However, bullet usage is a big behavioral indicator of alignment. Personally, I definitely think we should hold bullets on day 1 and potentially later as well. As Rift pointed out, it seems likely that the pressure on the baddies to shoot first (since they'll have to kill the rest of us to win). Additionally, if we're not shooting early, the innocent "team" will get bullets and vests faster than the baddie "team", unless they have abilities to offset that (and even then, to use those abilities, they need to post, which gives us chances to catch them). Also, I don't think we should have a public set of people guaranteed to shoot player X simply because that would make it really easy for baddies to land revenge bullets (although I suppose that risk is somewhat minimal considering the low baddie count... but it's another reason to force baddies to kill innocents and minimize innocent "friendly-fire").

We were told to volunteer for Ruffian. We have more than enough people who are likely to have volunteered. Blac chose to include that in the game, so your assumption that he would just choose to dump it because YOU dislike the mechanic makes no sense. I won't disagree that it leaves a lot more analysis in the realm of metagame than I personally would like, but you CAN balance a game around that. Furthermore, if we AREN'T suppose to work from that, Blac has had plenty of opportunity to say he's junked that. 

Throwing suspicion on people for trying to analyze the game is a very blatant villain tactic. It's possible you're not a villain, but this "You're trying to help the innocents, you must be evil!" BS always hurts the innocents. If you want to argue against my reasoning, that's fine. If you find some detail in my posts that actually is suspicious about me, fine. Accusing me based purely on my TRYING to do something positive is NOT fine. 

A full claim is a horrible idea, especially in a game this size. If we assume 2 villains - the most optimistic assumption - that means we have 5 innocents. The villains just pick something that's likely to exist, claim it, then kill off innocents who DON'T overlap with them. We have to pick which of the matching villain-innocent pairs are real or fake, and we have a 50/50 chance of being wrong if we're lucky enough for a villain to overlap. They'll take out our info roles first, so we won't be able to verify safely and we'd need a night anyway before we could do it. That's 2 villains, 2 nights, and we lose if we get it wrong twice. And that's the optimistic view.

4 hours ago, RocktheFox said:

Inu. I see your missing an eye their pilgrim. Lets not forget lady luck has a had in this game and a dust up isn't on schedule till the final curtain so lets sit back and in joy the show. 

Roleplay is fine in a game, but if you're going to roleplay, at least be a polite roleplayer. Writing other player's characters for them isn't fun at all for the other players. 

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4 minutes ago, InuyashaOhki said:

We were told to volunteer for Ruffian. We have more than enough people who are likely to have volunteered. Blac chose to include that in the game, so your assumption that he would just choose to dump it because YOU dislike the mechanic makes no sense. I won't disagree that it leaves a lot more analysis in the realm of metagame than I personally would like, but you CAN balance a game around that. Furthermore, if we AREN'T suppose to work from that, Blac has had plenty of opportunity to say he's junked that. 

Throwing suspicion on people for trying to analyze the game is a very blatant villain tactic. It's possible you're not a villain, but this "You're trying to help the innocents, you must be evil!" BS always hurts the innocents. If you want to argue against my reasoning, that's fine. If you find some detail in my posts that actually is suspicious about me, fine. Accusing me based purely on my TRYING to do something positive is NOT fine. 

A full claim is a horrible idea, especially in a game this size. If we assume 2 villains - the most optimistic assumption - that means we have 5 innocents. The villains just pick something that's likely to exist, claim it, then kill off innocents who DON'T overlap with them. We have to pick which of the matching villain-innocent pairs are real or fake, and we have a 50/50 chance of being wrong if we're lucky enough for a villain to overlap. They'll take out our info roles first, so we won't be able to verify safely and we'd need a night anyway before we could do it. That's 2 villains, 2 nights, and we lose if we get it wrong twice. And that's the optimistic view.

I mean, I'm not criticizing that you are analyzing. I just find your choice to analyze something finicky and disconnected to the actual play of the game when you had plenty of other avenues for analysis available somewhat suspicious. Also, it seems like you're overreacting here. It's not like I shot you or proposed that others shoot you. I merely noted it as lightly suspicious. Honestly, this response is way more suspicious than your first post.

There are 9 players. If there are two baddies, then there are 7 non-team baddies.

EDIT: I will elaborate, but my game of League just started, and I wanted this post in before night for the currency.

Edited by Rexozord

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1 minute ago, Rexozord said:

when you had plenty of other avenues for analysis available

Citation needed. <_< 

EDIT: The problem here is you're throwing suspicion based on the existence of analysis, not on any detail. You make the fatuous claim that I should have analyzed something else, but you don't say what else.

Edited by InuyashaOhki

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36 minutes ago, InuyashaOhki said:

Citation needed. <_< 

EDIT: The problem here is you're throwing suspicion based on the existence of analysis, not on any detail. You make the fatuous claim that I should have analyzed something else, but you don't say what else.

My apologies. I thought it was clear that the two strategic areas I discussed were examples of analysis that presented themselves. Obviously, those were the two I chose to pursue, but there are others that the game itself suggests (how should Sinical pick deputies? how should we use duels? how should dead innocents use revenge bullets, if at all? etc.) that I think would be better subjects for analysis than who may or may not have volunteered to be a baddie. Now, I have no doubt you could have analyzed any of these if you had chosen to, but you chose to analyze an aspect of the game that I consider to be mostly useless. And I wonder if you chose that because you thought it would be the most helpful in finding baddies, or if it was chosen because it's easier to analyze without helping the innocent's chances of winning.

Also, let's go back to the full claim discussion. We have 9 players, Sinical is confirmed innocent (and so doesn't have to claim anything, although his role appears to be public), and we suspect there are 2~3 non-innocents (I think 4 non-innocents is quite unlikely). That means we have 6~7 innocents. I think the chances for typical investigator roles here are small (and as such, I think the only "important" innocent role is the one everyone already knows). So we outnumber the non-innocents 2:1 (most likely). We don't lose too much in terms of information warfare (after all, it's not like we can discuss our roles in private). On the other hand, this puts a lot of pressure on the baddies (unless their abilities are fairly innocentish) to fake a role. Also, it seems that you're assuming that baddies will have an auto-kill of some kind, but I'm pretty sure they're confined to shooting and dueling just like everyone else. Of course, that's something we'll find out shortly. I just think you're making a lot of assumptions that this set-up will be like a typical WW set-up in your argument against a full claim, and the only reason I'm bringing up a full claim is because it seems like this set-up is very different from a typical WW set-up.

EDIT: Also, since blacjak seems to have missed deadline, it's likely we won't see results until after he's done working.

Edited by Rexozord

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1 hour ago, InuyashaOhki said:

We were told to volunteer for Ruffian. We have more than enough people who are likely to have volunteered. Blac chose to include that in the game, so your assumption that he would just choose to dump it because YOU dislike the mechanic makes no sense. I won't disagree that it leaves a lot more analysis in the realm of metagame than I personally would like, but you CAN balance a game around that. Furthermore, if we AREN'T suppose to work from that, Blac has had plenty of opportunity to say he's junked that. 

Throwing suspicion on people for trying to analyze the game is a very blatant villain tactic. It's possible you're not a villain, but this "You're trying to help the innocents, you must be evil!" BS always hurts the innocents. If you want to argue against my reasoning, that's fine. If you find some detail in my posts that actually is suspicious about me, fine. Accusing me based purely on my TRYING to do something positive is NOT fine. 

A full claim is a horrible idea, especially in a game this size. If we assume 2 villains - the most optimistic assumption - that means we have 5 innocents. The villains just pick something that's likely to exist, claim it, then kill off innocents who DON'T overlap with them. We have to pick which of the matching villain-innocent pairs are real or fake, and we have a 50/50 chance of being wrong if we're lucky enough for a villain to overlap. They'll take out our info roles first, so we won't be able to verify safely and we'd need a night anyway before we could do it. That's 2 villains, 2 nights, and we lose if we get it wrong twice. And that's the optimistic view.

Roleplay is fine in a game, but if you're going to roleplay, at least be a polite roleplayer. Writing other player's characters for them isn't fun at all for the other players. 

Over analyzation might mean you are compensating for something. 

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